most recent 30 from mathoverflow.net 2026-05-01T13:09:30Z https://mathoverflow.net/feeds/question/443211 https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/rdf https://mathoverflow.net/q/443211 7 Anindya https://mathoverflow.net/users/500511 2023-03-22T01:03:43Z 2023-03-25T07:50:04Z <p>The Axiom of Dependent Choice (DC) is often considered to be an &quot;intuitive and non-controversial&quot; version of choice used in the proofs of many theorems in Analysis. Similarly, the Axiom of Determinacy (AD) leads to especially nice properties for real numbers. Thus, in a sense, the system ZF + DC + AD is much &quot;nicer&quot; than ZFC, but maybe it restricts the &quot;richness&quot; of the set theoretic universe in some ways. Hence, I am wondering how this system interacts with large cardinals.</p> <p>In particular:</p> <ol> <li>Since AD is inconsistent with unrestricted Axiom of Choice (AC), are any of the &quot;standard&quot; large cardinal axioms - strongly inaccessible, Mahlo, measurable, rank-into-rank etc - inconsistent with ZF + DC + AD?</li> <li>Conversely, can any such large cardinals - for example, strong inaccessibles - be <em>proved to exist</em> in this system? (Since the usual objection to proving their existence doesn't exist in this system)</li> <li>Will the typical &quot;size relations&quot; between large cardinals in ZFC hold? For instance, is a measurable cardinal going to be inaccessible in this system? (The only proof I know uses well ordering) Is the smallest measurable greater than the smallest inaccessible?</li> </ol> <p>I realize the question is quite broad - I am interested in sampling the kinds of results that may have been proved/conjectured.</p> https://mathoverflow.net/questions/443211/-/443372#443372 9 Gabe Goldberg https://mathoverflow.net/users/102684 2023-03-23T23:47:09Z 2023-03-25T03:28:26Z <p>An unpublished theorem due to Woodin (which appears without proof as Theorem 7.35 of &quot;In search of Ultimate L&quot;) states that if the <span class="math-container">$\Omega$</span> conjecture holds and there is a proper class of Woodin cardinals, then there is a partially ordered set <span class="math-container">$\mathbb P$</span> such that if <span class="math-container">$G\subseteq \mathbb P$</span> is a <span class="math-container">$V$</span>-generic filter and <span class="math-container">$\mathbb R^* = (\mathbb R)^{V[G]}$</span>, then <span class="math-container">$V(\mathbb R^*)$</span> is a model of AD. The hypotheses of this theorem are known to be consistent: in fact they hold in any model with a proper class of Woodins that satisfies Woodin's weakly homogeneous iteration hypothesis (WHIH), and this includes many of the current fine structure models by Steel's theorem that such models satisfy UBH; see Woodin's <em>The Axiom of Determinacy, Forcing Axioms, and the Nonstationary Ideal</em>, Definition 10.4 and Theorem 10.151. The model <span class="math-container">$V(\mathbb R^*)$</span> will in this context satisfy ZF + DC + AD plus a proper class of Woodin cardinals. If there is a proper class of cardinals with some stronger large cardinal property in <span class="math-container">$V$</span>, say a proper class of extendible cardinals for concreteness, then <span class="math-container">$V(\mathbb R^*)$</span> will have a proper class of extendible cardinals by standard lifting arguments; but the <span class="math-container">$\Omega$</span> conjecture is not known to be consistent with the existence of a proper class of extendible cardinals (or even a proper class of measurable Woodin cardinals).</p> <p>In summary, if ZFC plus the <span class="math-container">$\Omega$</span> conjecture is consistent with a proper class of <span class="math-container">$X$</span> cardinals, then the Axiom of Determinacy is consistent with a proper class of <span class="math-container">$X$</span> cardinals, for any <span class="math-container">$X\in \{\text{Woodin, Extendible, Superduperhuge, etc}\}$</span>. Moreover the <span class="math-container">$\Omega$</span> conjecture is consistent with a proper class of Woodin cardinals assuming the existence of a proper class of Woodin cardinals is consistent.</p>