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I've had a Zojirushi BB-PAC20 for 7 1/2 years. I average about a loaf a day. Back when I got it I entered a custom bake cycle that gives it much more rising time than the built in cycles.

It's been working great until recently. In the last several days, the loaves have not risen as much as usual and the tops sag down (sort of indented downward; I'm not sure if there is a correct term for this).

I verified that the bread machine still remembers my custom bake cycle; it has not reverted to something built-in.

I tried adding about 25% more yeast, and that did rise somewhat more, but the indentation was still there.

Here are the only recent changes:

-- After years of using Red Star active dry yeast, I switched to Saf-Instant because it was cheaper at the restaurant supply store and had a good reputation online. I buy yeast at the restauarant supply store in 1lb packages (they carry both brands) because that is so much cheaper than buying the little jars at the grocery store. But the Saf-Instant worked fine for many loaves before this problem started up, so I don't see how that could be the problem.

-- The bread pan is losing its nonstick coating, and Zojirushi no longer makes replacements for that model. Sooner or later I'm going to have to break down and buy a new bread machine, but for now I'm making do.

My workaround is to let the bread sit in the breadmaker 1 hour to moisten up the sides a bit from condensation so it comes out easier. Lots of the crust remains on the sides of the pan, to be washed out before the next loaf.

But the loss of the nonstick has been very gradual, and this problem started happening very suddenly. Also, the indentation is there when the bake cycle completes, before the 1-hour wait.

As little as two weeks ago, all was well.

Any suggestions?

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    Any changes in the weather (I'm thinking mainly of the temperature of ingredients)? Flour brand? Commented Jul 11 at 18:52
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    ...and even if same brand, is it a different bag of flour? For the non-stick failing, you could try greasing the pan with solid shortening, but I doubt that's the cause of your dent. Might help you lose less to sticking, though. My best guess (and it's a guess, not an answer) is that the loaf is overproofed and that's the sag/dent root cause. If the dough rises so much that there's no elasticity left for oven spring, the loaf collapses rather than rising more when baked. Commented Jul 11 at 19:08
  • @Chris H The weather here near Seattle changes frequently, but nothing unusual has been happening with the weather. Same flour brand and type I've been using for many years; Kroger. Commented Jul 11 at 19:17
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    @Ecnerwal With a previous breadmaker with a pan that also lost its non-stick, I tried greasing it and found that it made no difference. I believe that's because the kneading just wipes it all off of the pan and incorporates it into the loaf. Commented Jul 11 at 19:18
  • This question is similar to: Why does my bread collapse in my bread machine?. If you believe it’s different, please edit the question, make it clear how it’s different and/or how the answers on that question are not helpful for your problem. Commented Jul 12 at 3:32

3 Answers 3

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In my experience with bread machines, 99% of the time this problem is solved by adjusting the water content of the loaf. Too much water leads to poor structure and the loaf collapses down from the sides of the pan, leaving you with a loaf that looks like this simple ASCI drawing:

     |\    /|
     | \__/ |
     |      |
     |______|

This is normally solved by reducing the water - small adjustments of ~30 ml (2 tablespoons) are enough to make this happen or not and are particularly commonly needed with changes in batches of flour. This is often seasonal associated too as flour comes from different parts of the world at different times and has different breeds of wheat with different hydration properties.

A sign that you are getting close to the right amount of water is the baked loaf being the right texture or slightly dense at the bottom and quite light textured/open texture (bigger bubbles) at the top.

If you haven't been, observing your dough during the kneading stages should tell you whether or not there is too much water in the dough and you can adjust on the fly - it should form a soft and sticky ball but not be too tightly balled (too much flour/too little water). If the paddle(s) can move freely within the dough without mixing the outer, then you have far too much water. If the dough spins without touching the sides it needs more water.

The sides staying up and the top collapsing has nothing to do with the pan being non-stick or not as I've had this happen in new non-stick pans.

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    Thanks, I found the same suggestion in the troubleshooting steps in the breadmaker's user's guide. I tried reducing the water from 1 1/2 cups to 1 1/3 cups. That worked great! No indentation at all. Commented Jul 15 at 6:05
  • ...and the texture is better than it has been for the last couple weeks or so. Commented Jul 15 at 6:12
  • @GregLovern Yep, glad it worked out for you! - But it is why this is a duplicate of the question I linked in a comment on your question... Commented Jul 15 at 8:11
  • @bob1, in that case you should add this answer to that question, because none of the higher-voted answers there even mention reducing the water. Commented Jul 15 at 15:52
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    To get the bread to rise as much as before the problem started, I'm now using two teaspoons--TWICE as much as before the problem started. I'm going to get through the 1lb brick of Saf-Instand and then go back to Red Star. BTW the recipe I started from originally called for 2 teaspoons of yeast, but when I set a custom bake cycle 7 1/2 years ago that greatly lengthened the rising times, I had to reduce the yeast to 1 teaspoon. Commented Jul 22 at 17:57
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I can see a few possibilities:

  • You have a problem with the yeast: it could be you got a bad batch. You could switch back to your old yeast and see if it works again
  • It's over-proofing because of the yeast: instant yeast gets to work faster, your bread could be over-rising and then collapsing. Keep an eye on it and see when it reaches its optimal rise, and change your program accordingly
  • It's over-proofing because of temperature: if your kitchen is getting very hot (like mine at the moment) then it could be getting too warm in the breadmaker and rising too quickly. Again changing the program to reduce rising time may help
  • The bread maker may be malfunctioning: a sensor, heating element or something else could have gone wrong. Time it to see if it's following the program. Make sure the top is closing properly, and clean the machine thoroughly
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After years of using Red Star active dry yeast, I switched to Saf-Instant

This is an obvious source of the problem. Active dry yeast and instant yeast are not the same product, and don't work the same way. A recipe that works for one of them won't work exactly the same for the other.

You'll have to develop a new recipe for the new yeast, or get back to active dry. Preferably from the same brand, as they can have slight differences in the rising behavior.

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    My gut feeling was the same, but OP writes: “ But the Saf-Instant worked fine for many loaves before this problem started up”. Commented Jul 12 at 10:14

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